ep. 89 - Vinh Giang
Bio
Vinh Gian is first and foremost a businessperson and entrepreneur. While in his 20s, he started an online business with two good friends; all of them had decided to leave their careers in accounting and pharmacy, to pursue their dream of building a successful business. Their online platform, Encyclopedia of Magic, now teaches magic to almost 50,000 students around the world. For this innovative and successful business idea, Vinh and his friends were awarded Young Entrepreneur of the Year.
Vinh’s mission in business and life is to share the psychology of illusion. He has devoted himself to understanding the ways in which people are fooled by illusions and by the tricks we play on ourselves. During his presentations, he demonstrates how this occurs.
Coming from the humble beginnings of a Vietnamese refugee family, Vinh has worked with companies from all over the world. Mentored by internationally recognized experts in innovation and success psychology, such as Matthew Michalewicz, he shares fresh, cutting-edge topics with his audience.
Transcript
ep. 89 - Vinh Giang
Gail Davis: Vinh Giang is a successful businessman and entrepreneur having started a successful online business while in his 20s. For his innovative business idea he was awarded Young Entrepreneur of the Year. Coming [00:01:00] from the humble beginnings of a Vietnamese refugee family, Vinh now works with companies from all over the world sharing the core elements of communication from one of the world's most secretive crafts, magic. Welcome to today's episode of GDA Podcast, Vinh Giang.
Kyle Davis: Hey, how are you?
Vinh Giang: Thank you Kyle. Thank you Gail. As you just did that intro I've now removed my neck brace for the audience, because my head has grown significantly. Thank you.
Kyle Davis: It is massive. Massive head.
Vinh Giang: Thank [00:01:30] you. Yeah, look. My neck muscles are incredible strong.
Gail Davis: That's awesome.
Kyle Davis: It's important to activate them.
Vinh Giang: Yes. Correct.
Gail Davis: Vinh, I've had the pleasure of meeting you and I am so intrigued by the part of the introduction that says you came from a refugee family, so maybe for our listeners you might start there and give a little bit of your background and your story.
Vinh Giang: Yeah, definitely. My mom and dad are refugees from Vietnam. They escaped Vietnam in 1979 and after a crazy [00:02:00] journey which I want to give you a tiny bit of a window into. When my mom and dad escaped the only time they could escape ... Because Mom and Dad were entrepreneurs in Vietnam. We owned noodle factories and everything. But then we were literally kicked out of all of that because of the Viet Cong and they literally ended up in the jungles of Vietnam and they had to become fishermen to learn the patrol routes of the Viet Cong, and what Dad realized was they could only leave on the night that it was the stormiest night, [00:02:30] because that was the only night the Viet Cong didn't patrol, and it was crazy because I want to share this journey because it will give the audience context on who I am too, but then Dad literally had to on the stormiest night leave.
When everyone looked at that as being suicide, my dad saw that as being opportunity, so they escaped the Vietnam borders but then the next danger that they would meet is the pirates. The Thailand pirates that knew Vietnamese refugees were leaving with a ton of gold and then would come and rob them, but then Dad [00:03:00] carved these fake AK-47s out of wood and tanned him and his seven brothers really dark so they had fake guns and they got through that. Then they ran out of fuel, and then from that point my grandfather saved us because he said, "It's okay. Just follow the smoke. If you find smoke we'll find land," and that's the first time they encountered an oil rig in the ocean.
Then these Kiwis, these New Zealanders came down and said, "Oh, look. We can save you but we have to break your boat," and my family were thinking, " [00:03:30] Oh crap, we've met the white pirates now," but they were the good people. Long story short they saved us. We ended up in Australia in 1981 and I was born in 1986 but my family went through hell before they had to start all over again, and that was crazy.
Kyle Davis: From that, there's a lot of people who use the clichéd phrase "opportunity out of chaos," but it's depending on what you define as chaos. The layperson saying if [00:04:00] you're evacuating on the stormiest night would be chaos, but like you said, your dad saw it as an opportunity.
Vinh Giang: Yeah.
Kyle Davis: I'm just wondering if you can expand on that just a little bit.
Vinh Giang: I think it comes from something we all know these days is that out of chaos is what breeds brilliance. Adversity is the training that creates great leaders, and my dad and his brothers I believe had a wonderful ... At the time it didn't seem wonderful but that environment forced the leader [00:04:30] out of them. Otherwise when you're in comfort, nothing comes from comfort. Comfort is a state of idleness and nothing really comes from that, so not only is that chaos something that is opportunity. Chaos is the training required to create somebody brave. That's the mentality I always take because when he came to Australia, no English, no skills that was applicable to Australia, everything had to be learned from [00:05:00] scratch again at the age of 25.
Kyle Davis: So don't be comfortable.
Vinh Giang: Yeah. Look, that's why I'm here in Los Angeles right now. It's why I moved as well. I got super comfortable and it's the truth is that in my own circle, in my own network I already felt super successful. I had that kind of mindset, which was damaging to me because it stopped growth. And use this example. You walk into a room. Your partner is cooking up a storm, just cooking beautiful [00:05:30] blueberry cupcakes. You smell the beautiful blueberry cupcakes and you're like, "Honey, this is amazing," and then five minutes later you no longer smell it but the smell is still there.
To me, human beings are incredible at adapting. So much so that we forget that that adapting ability of ours is like a superpower. It really is. We adapt to things so quickly and it also could be a good thing but it also could be a bad thing, so if you get addicted to comfort and you adapt and you stay there, [00:06:00] it's a bad thing.
Kyle Davis: I like the fact that since your background is magic and all things magic really, the fact that it was a fake AK-47 carved out of wood. Have you ever thought about that? It's an absolute illusion.
Vinh Giang: I can now add that into my dad on my keynote now.
Kyle Davis: You're welcome.
Vinh Giang: Oh, hey [crosstalk 00:06:24]
Kyle Davis: Can I get royalties by the way? I need royalties for that. Just throwing-
Vinh Giang: Definitely. Definitely. Gail, make sure we hook this up.
Gail Davis: Yes, yes, yes.
Vinh Giang: [00:06:30] Whatever details you'd like, Kyle no worries, but interesting thing you brought up. What saved my family and our village was playing cards. I know this sounds ridiculous. When the US soldiers were in Vietnam and the Australian soldiers were in Vietnam, a group of US soldiers came through our village and they weren't able to stay in our village but they gave my dad a packet of cards and said, "Scatter these playing cards around [00:07:00] the village and it will scare the Viet Cong."
And what was crazy is that these cards protected our family, so I always buy playing cards now since I was young from the US Playing Company which is Bicycle Playing Cards, because when my dad saw the ace of spades he got super emotional and was like, "Where did you get this? Where did you get this?" The ace of spades is very specific on the box of playing cards, the standard packets, and seriously after that we bought like 2,000 packets of cards [00:07:30] from Bicycle and I've got a massive supply in my apartment but that also was something magic related that I did see that saved my family. It was cards. It was playing cards.
Kyle Davis: I think I know what the significance is of the playing cards, but do you have the story behind that?
Vinh Giang: You mean as in ...
Kyle Davis: How did it protect the village?
Vinh Giang: Oh, sorry. Yeah of course. Because the Viet [00:08:00] Cong were very ... At the time a lot of the American soldiers played cards. Texas hold 'em, blackjack, what not, so anytime you scattered these cards around the village it gave the Viet Cong a sense of, "Holy crap, there are American soldiers here." So that bought us time. What that did is it buys us time. Dad would grab these cards and scatter them toward the outer parts of the village to buy them time to better flee the village. It was [00:08:30] very real because we were against the north and the tension was real.
Kyle Davis: I think that's just again, to be able to buy time and the misdirection thing. It's interesting how you can draw parallels to magic.
Gail Davis: How did you personally get into magic and how did that all come about?
Vinh Giang: Magic is easily the most fraudulent way to get attention, so it's not that beautiful story from my grandfather [00:09:00] unfortunately. It's more so I was a teenage kid. I was 12 and 13 years old and I starved attention. I felt like I wasn't getting any attention from anybody at school. I wasn't the coolest kid. I wasn't getting attention from any of the ladies. I really wanted to find a girlfriend as well. I starved attention from everyone. I was just a kid that conformed. I was the kid that was good at being invisible, but deep inside I knew I wanted to be noticed. I wanted [00:09:30] attention, and magic was just the best way and to clarify, the way it started was Mom and Dad used to be super cheap, which was awesome because it saved money, but they used to send us to the state library after school because it was free childcare essentially. They literally sent us to the library and the librarian at this library gave me my first magic book ever.
Kyle Davis: Nice.
Vinh Giang: [00:10:00] Then I stole that book too, so that was nice.
Kyle Davis: You got to do a little bit of sleight of hand for that five finger discount.
Vinh Giang: Exactly. That was originally our revenue there.
Kyle Davis: When we went to record earlier you had the common immigrant life of learning to play instruments and study hard in school so that way we don't have to go back to the homeland. So what was it like ... It doesn't matter really where you're from. You always [00:10:30] hear the same thing. From there, what was it like when you started going down this magic path, and what was the response from your family?
Vinh Giang: The most wonderful thing that magic gave me was confidence, and confidence to be me. Confidence to now dare to live the life that I wanted to live, so like you said before Kyle is that there is an Asian prophecy, believe it or not. There is this default script that we all tend to live out, and in [00:11:00] my culture it was, "Get a degree. Become a doctor. Become an entrepreneur, lawyer. Buy an investment property, then buy a second investment property and buy a third one, and then forever be in debt," and there was just this mindset. There was just this path laid out for me and I just went, "But that's not the story that I want to live." Magic gave me the confidence to now go, "You know what? I want to live my own story, my own life," and that's what magic gave me.
It was strange because that confidence came from the attention [00:11:30] and from people saying to me ... These words may seem like nothing but they were everything to me at the time. When people said to me, "Wow! You're amazing. Oh my goodness, you're incredible." I was a kid that was starving, and when I got that that allowed me to blossom. So not the best metaphor but that was literally the fertilizer I needed, and when I got that, oh wow. It was just like, mm, it was so good.
Kyle Davis: [00:12:00] We mentioned that you're a successful businessman and entrepreneur, and oddly enough it has to go with magic so tell people what it is that you did and the company that you built.
Vinh Giang: When I was in my late teens I discovered one thing, and I learned one lesson that really helped me shape it all and it was, we live in a world now where it's no longer "build it and they will come." It's more in a world where if they come, then build it. As a [00:12:30] magician, what I started to realize was there were all these people who wanted to learn magic from me.
The first thing people would say right after I performed a trick is, "How did you do that?" Then what I realized was well, as an entrepreneur, in my entrepreneurial hat, I go, "Hey, hang on. I could monetize that how did you do that part." Because then I started to monetize that. I started to go, "Oh, well come do a session with me and I'll teach you. It's $50 an hour." And they're like, "Yeah, sure. No worries." I was like, "Holy crap, it's too cheap." Then I started to realize, "Hang on, but teaching people one on one is not [00:13:00] scalable. This sucks because I only have so many hours a day. If I do 10 hours a day that's only $500 a day. I want to create a higher ROI."
So now I go, "Why don't I film this and then sell it to people?" I thought, "This is a great idea," because most people now don't like learning from books anymore. We live in a world where attention span is dropping by the day, so I thought, "Great, I'm going to create a whole massive encyclopedia of magic tricks and then sell people that as an online course." And that's what I did. I [00:13:30] literally sold one of my dad's investment properties with his permission and used that $100,000 to build the online business. I never lost so much money so quickly before, and it was exciting for me. It was scary for Dad, but wow. My dad's belief in me and that investment my dad made in me, that $100,000, that was the foundation for everything. I lost all of that money. We didn't make any kind of ROI on that, but that was $100,000 worth of lessons [00:14:00] that allowed me to make the business successful.
Kyle Davis: Obviously you hinted at it. You didn't start off on a golden walkway. What was it like building it and then what was turn that made it successful?
Vinh Giang: Many different things. The biggest lesson from my dad was that he said to me every challenge in life, it's kind of like a war. Again, just a horrible analogy, but it's kind of like a battle. [00:14:30] And he goes, "How do you win a battle? You've got to make sure you've got more soldiers. You've got to make sure you got enough soldiers." And he said, "Son, the battles you're fighting in your life right now, you have no soldiers in your army." I was like, "Dad, stop this Confucius crap. Just give it to me straight, Dad. Come on."
But he loves the Confucius stuff, and he goes, "Well Son, every time you read a book that author now stands behind you in an army willing to fight for any battle you desire, and Son, you've got 10 soldiers that stand behind you. You've read 10 books in your life. [00:15:00] Your army sucks. The battle requires 500." And my dad gave me his credit card at the time, which didn't have a lot of money on it but my dad said, "Build your damn army." And from that point in my early 20s I started reading like crazy.
If I wanted to learn more about online lead management I'd read 10 books in that area on online lead management. If I wanted to learn more about how do I manage my team, I would then immediately read 10 books on leadership. Isaac Newton said this. We should stand on the shoulders of [00:15:30] giants, and when I started to stand on the shoulders of giants and stop falling victim to that mindset that, "I should know everything since I was born. I should know everything right now in my life that will make me successful." The moment I switched that to now reading and learning, things started to happen.
Kyle Davis: I'm a big fan of reading, but I personally like to use the clichéd phrase of, "If you're not stealing you're not trying." So I'd like to steal [crosstalk 00:15:54] ideas. Back to theft. I don't even know why [crosstalk 00:15:57]
Vinh Giang: I feel like you're making me [00:16:00] seem very fraudulent to the audience right now, and thank you for that. And thank you for that. That was the last [crosstalk 00:16:05]
Kyle Davis: That's on me. That's on me. That's on me.
Vinh Giang: But I feel like the next thing is, then I've also noticed in 2015 you were ... The criminal record. That's all it's missing.
Kyle Davis: But I'm trying to say what I like about it, and I think to your dad's point and what you learned was that other people have already done it. Learn from them. There's no intent ... Why try to reinvent the wheel? [00:16:30] Why do anything? Just buy it, learn it, and then move on, unless there's actually something that's never been done before.
Vinh Giang: To that point as well Kyle, I'm currently trying to work on my book and it's literally titled The Most Fraudulent Book Ever Written.
Gail Davis: Really?
Vinh Giang: Yeah.
Kyle Davis: So there's three strikes for frauds and theft.
Vinh Giang: Yeah. Well there we go. I just thought why not just own that? But it's true. I'm writing that title out of respect for the people that I've learned from, [00:17:00] and when you read as much as maybe you and I both do or we all do on this podcast, you as well Gail, is that what we realize is everything is built on other people's thoughts. Nothing is truly that unique. What is innovation at the end of the day? Innovation is just composition. It's all that it is, so I just want to be very upfront about my composition.
Kyle Davis: There's a very big difference between inventing and innovating.
Vinh Giang: Correct. Correct.
Gail Davis: When we [00:17:30] were talking earlier you said to really sum you up you're a magician, you're a keynote speaker, and you're an entrepreneur. I'm curious how you took the things you learned through magic and the things you learned through business and how you paired those together and created a keynote speech, because I know you use this magic to talk about things like influence and perspective and showmanship and I'm just curious how that all came together.
Vinh Giang: It [00:18:00] came together for me Gail when I started performing magic. I started to realize that magic brings out a certain part of people. When I was there in the office for you and I performed, it doesn't matter how young or old you are. It brings out this inner child in people, and to me that in a child is easily one of the most beautiful parts of a human being, and we also have it, even those of you listening right now. We also have this part of us and magic is one of the very rare art forms that can bring and evoke that inner child.
What I started [00:18:30] to realize was that when you're performing magic, whatever you say while you're performing, it sticks. Because when you bring out that emotional reaction in people and you pair that with a message, it sticks and it felt useless sticking these magic messages about how amazing I am as a magician to the magic. It felt after a while kind of nauseating as well, because I knew that it was just sleight of hand, but what I started [00:19:00] to realize then as a speaker, and this is where I sought more fulfillment, is that if I attached a meaningful message to that experiential moment the message sticks, and this could be something that could be the spark that ignites the flame in people's lives, and that's when I started to realize this whole world of speaking.
I didn't know speaking existed. I didn't think it was an industry. I just didn't think it was an industry or a career path, and when I [00:19:30] realized its existence, the two and two came together. That if I could create this emotional experience, if I could pair it with a message that is strong enough, I could create change. That's where it came about, and then I dived into the world of magic and looked for the parallels. Looked for the common threads between the world of magic and the world of business, the world of magic and life, and that's where my keynotes came from.
Kyle Davis: You have four of them and they all start with the psychology [00:20:00] of illusion, and maybe there's more than four. Times have changed and we probably haven't updated our system yet, but you have one on influence, misdirection, perspective, and another one on showmanship. In each one of those maybe there might some seemingly overlap but I was just wondering if you could touch on each one of those and how what you learned from magic can then be imparted on business and life.
Vinh Giang: Sure. Let's do this via auditory, our ears, but I [00:20:30] want you to imagine this. While you're watching a magician perform and you get fooled by the magician, you have to question, "How did he or she fool me?" And the way the magician has fooled you, because they've locked you into a [solum intelevi 00:20:45]. They're making you watch it only from your perspective. There's no collaboration between you and anybody else watching this. It's just you watching it by yourself, so they've created this situation where you have a [solum intelevi 00:20:56] now, so what that tells us is [00:21:00] that not only can magicians fool us, but life and business can fool us when we fall victim to that [solum intelevi 00:21:06].
When we look at things only from our own perspective and we make the assumption that all this new realm of business. There are all these new marketing techniques that I have to ... It's too difficult. It's too hard. It's impossible. It's not that it's impossible, these new platforms, it's just that you've fallen victim to that [solum intelevi 00:21:22] If while you were watching a trick you had asked one of your friends to watch from the left side, your friend would be able to tell you how that trick works. [00:21:30] They'll be able to solve that problem, because a magic trick is just a problem that can't be solved.
You take that same kind of mindset and you go, "Well in business, I don't understand how the new platform works for marketing," but you should engage in somebody else who has a different perspective to you and a different set of experiences, and that perspective will shine the light on the solution, so again it's how do you debunk magic? It's with multiple perspectives, and as magicians we create these [00:22:00] problems so that you cannot solve them, so if you now have insight to how you solve the biggest problems and the most difficult problems, you can solve the simpler problems you experience in business in life.
Kyle Davis: I like the way that you said if you just had a friend standing to the left to be able to look at it, because when a magician performs they get to choose the venue. Stereotypically it's a stage an no one's behind them. There's no one to the side. It's just people strictly in front, but if it's in the round, they have to do something else. It can't be [00:22:30] a simple something behind their back type thing, and so it allows you to have that opportunity to learn more and shift your perspective on those things.
Vinh Giang: It allows you to see reality for what it actually is, not for what you perceive it to be.
Kyle Davis: You perceive it with all the knowledge that you have, because they gave you everything that you could see.
Vinh Giang: Yes, exactly.
Kyle Davis: But the reality is if you shift your perspective then you have more available knowledge.
Vinh Giang: Absolutely. Absolutely. Something that I normally do, and [00:23:00] this is now connected to one of the things I speak about as well, is we all make permanent judgments about ourselves. We tend to make these judgments like, "Oh, I could never do this." No, the correct term is you can't do this right now, so what I do with the audience is I perform a trick and you'll have to use your imagination and give me the benefit of the doubt. This trick is amazing and the audience goes, "Wow, that's amazing!" And they give me a big round of applause. You just have to take my good word for this. I am really good, [00:23:30] and when the audience reacts to this, right after the trick I say to the audience, "Okay, now who in this audience right now can come on stage and perform this for me right now?"
Not a hand goes up in the audience. Maybe one or two because they do magic, but rarely anyone. Then after that what I say is, "Okay, interesting. The question now I ask you is why can nobody in this room do this? It's because you don't know how. You don't have the knowledge. So let's close that knowledge gap." So I literally teach the audience how this trick is done and the trick is so simple that some of the audience members actually get pissed off, [00:24:00] and then I show them how the trick is ... And then you get this massive, "Ahh," and then after that I go, "Okay, now immediately after this, one minute 45 seconds later I'm going to ask you the same question. Who here now believes they can do this?" 80% of the hands in the rooms go up.
And I go, "Can you see how knowledge affects beliefs? Can you see how knowledge influences our beliefs? How many things do you believe right now you cannot do simply because you do not have the knowledge? Don't hate on [00:24:30] your capabilities because you don't have the knowledge. You are capable of more than you know." So again I open up the conversation on with magicians, all we do is we're knowledge seekers. We continually seek knowledge and as a result we're continually able to create magic because we're doing things you just don't know how to do yet, that's all.
Kyle Davis: And if you're not learning, you're not growing and if you're not growing, you're dying.
Vinh Giang: Correct. Correct.
Kyle Davis: You and I ... I like you. We think alike. [00:25:00] I can obviously think of what the importance of having good showmanship is in business and in magic, but how do you impart that on an audience who like you said, if they just switched their perspective just a little bit they would probably understand a little bit more as to why that's important?
Vinh Giang: This came from me being a teacher in the world of magic. I taught sleight of hand and I had hundreds of videos teaching sleight of hand yet my students never became successful magicians, and this made [00:25:30] me really angry because I felt crippled as a teacher. I could not understand, and when I saw my student perform in person when we did these live classes, their sleight of hand was impeccable. It was amazing. I wanted to give them a standing ovation watching them, but they were failing professionally, and it made me realize I was not teaching them showmanship, which is a fancy word for communication skills, which is a fancy term for being able to connect with other people.
Then what I realized was they were [00:26:00] great technically yet they were horrible at trying to build connections with people, and it was because they didn't have good communication skills. Then I realized after speaking this was the exact same problem in the corporate world is they go through university, the employees, being technically trained, wonderfully trained technically, and then they're thrown into the real world with the assumption that they're able to build powerful and meaningful connections with people, without the skillset.
My magicians [00:26:30] in my school started becoming more successful once I taught showmanship and I thought this is the exact same thing the business world needs. Our people are only as good as they can communicate. We send them to all these conferences. We send them to all these retreats to build on these technical skills, yet we never teach them the skill to be able to build the bridge to the consumer, because without this bridge which is the communication skills, nothing can be delivered to the other side. You're living on an island by yourself. [00:27:00] You're only as good as you can communicate.
Kyle Davis: From communication comes influence, which is another thing that you talk about and one of the things that I like when you see certain magic tricks is the magician will say, "Hey, I need you to do this," or some command, call/response type thing, and you just do it because for whatever reason. You never question what it is but there's influence over authority and stuff like that so I'm just wondering if you can speak to that as well.
Vinh Giang: Yeah, definitely [00:27:30] and great segue by the way Kyle. You are an absolutely pro at this.
Kyle Davis: I'm good. I'm really good.
Vinh Giang: Yeah, you're good. We both should get neck braces together next time we go shopping.
Kyle Davis: Yes.
Vinh Giang: When I talk about influence, I demonstrate in on stage and I literally do what you say. Isn't it funny? With a magic trick on stage, I just say, "Look, I'm going to show you some magic. Could you just give me your wallet?" And without question they will give me their wallet, and I do all these things on stage to [00:28:00] highlight to people that influence is one of the most powerful forces in life, which alludes to the point of wisdom, and this is again borrowing the words of Jim Rohn. You're the direct reflection of the top five people you spend time with.
And you know what? As leaders, I get it. A lot of leaders out there in the marketplace and just in life, we're told to look after our people first. We always have to look after our people, but you have to look after yourself too and this message is really for the leaders out there that if [00:28:30] you're the direct reflection on the top five people you spend time with, what that essentially means is you get to choose who you become in the future by deciding who you spend time with today. It means you can craft the leader that you become, and my question to the leaders there quite upfront is, who are in your top five and are you consciously building this environment? Think about anyone amazing in this world. If Michael Jordan ... I love basketball, but if Michael Jordan for example spent time with swimmers [00:29:00] all his life, would he have become the great basketballer that he is? I don't think so.
So it's just getting the leaders there in the audience to go within and go, "Am I building the right environment for myself to flourish?" Because that's on you. It's not on your employer. It's not on the people you ... It's on you. I find that lesson I've used over and over and over again in my life. I'll give you one quick example.
I wanted to become a speaker, so what I did was I found the best speaker in Australia, Matthew [00:29:30] Michalewicz, big shout out to an incredible speaker in Australia. To get his attention, because he wouldn't reply to my emails, anything. A bit of a jerk at the start, but I bought 1,000 of his books and my wife was pissed. She was angry. I took a photo with myself and all of the books and I sent it to him. I said, "Please, Matthew. Give me an hour of your time." We became best friends, and out of that relationship my speaking career was born. He taught me everything [00:30:00] I needed to know, and again, if I didn't have him in my top five I do not believe I would be where I am today.
Kyle Davis: Good on you for being able to have an affiliate background and sell all those books after you bought them.
Vinh Giang: The funny thing is I gave them out for free because I couldn't get rid of them fast enough, and my wife was like, "Get rid of those books. I don't want them anymore." But the quick thing. I now, only because [00:30:30] I can, I do buy 1,000 of his books every year but I do this out of love and out of respect for how much he has changed my life.
Gail Davis: That's awesome.
Kyle Davis: That's very cool. Well, I think this is a good place for us to wrap up, so with that being said if you would like to have Vinh Giang come and speak at your event and wow you with his magic and then inspire you to shift your perspective and increase your influence just with a little misdirection and showmanship, you can ... Look at all that. That's like [00:31:00] SEO rich. That's so SEO rich right there. You can do so by contacting GDA Speakers at 214-420-1999 or by going to GDASpeakers.com. If you go to GDAPodcast.com you'll be able to see the transcript, videos. I think we'll probably put a video or two up of you from your YouTube page or something like that, as well as any books or anything like that. That being said, Vinh, thanks for joining us.
Gail Davis: Thank you, Vinh.
Vinh Giang: Thank you Gail Davis: It was great talking to you.